Full Marks

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So, just a quick question then: Are we saying that anyone who scores 1000 in an exam must have been cheating? Or, are we saying that it is OK to score 1000 in some exams, but not in others, because it must be too hard to score 1000?

If we are not careful, then anyone who ever scores 1000 (or whatever the top mark is) is always in danger of being labelled a cheat. Is it not better to accept that someone has worked hard on a subject and has passed because they actually know their stuff?

I would add by the way that I do not condone cheating in any way, shape or form, and anyone who uses BDs (let alone someone who is stupid enough to admit it!) is not worth whatever an employer is daft enough to pay them; however, I do sometimes feel that (certainly in the UK) we seem to have a way of bashing those who do well, and salute the gallant loser.

 

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Nobody said that EVERYONE who scores 1000 cheats. We said that it is far more likely that someone who scores a 1000 has cheated.

Out of passing almost 60 exams, I've scored only one perfect 1000, and that was on 70-059, TCP/IP. There were only 30 questions, and if you knew subnetting, you could ace it.

Ah, but they ARE in danger of being labelled a cheat. Everyone will form their own opinions. That's the risk you take when you come out and state that you got an even thousand.

That said, we will all take factors into account. If someone who is violently anti-braindump who has been in the IT industry for a long time, and has worked with the technology gets 1000, they likely know their stuff. But if someone just coming out of training school gets 1000... well, chances are, they either purposely or accidentally used a braindump.

Sorry, man, I call them as I see them.

I'd rather pass legitimately and be bashed than be a cheater and be praised.

 

Agree with all of what BM just said really.

 

That's good... I was seeking clarification...

I'd struggle, given I only know basic subnetting.

It is just so 'unfortunate' that anyone seen to do well is tarred with a brush that should only be truly deserved by those few(?) who do BD/cheat.

In all my years working for the same employer I have often heard the moans and back bites from people who have been passed over for promotion, when someone who actually does their job better gets the nod. Then we hear the cries of 'well, he's his best drinking buddy' or 'she's sleeping with him', and suchlike. It's not based on the fact that they know little about the person in reality and, in actual fact, the person did deserve the promo.

I used to go to school (yes, many years ago) and I remember one lad who could ace exams. He wouldn't have to revise, he was just able to take the stuff in like a sponge in class and then sit and pass. Really, he should have failed every exam, but he didn't. I don't know if he had a photographic memeory, but he was amazing.

Maybe we should be a little more positive, until/unless an individual actually says 'I used TK' or whatever else is out there.

I'd be disappointed if you didn't. That's what makes CF the place it is. I may not always agree with you; however, I do respect your opinion.

Surely, you'd sooner pass legitimately and be praised?

 

Hi Dom.

Don't you think it is disappointing that we tend to err on the side of 'he got full marks, so he must be cheating'.

As I said, it isn't just exams, it tends to happen in the rest of life too.

If I ever got 1000 in an MS exam, I'd be wary of shouting it out... when I shouldn't be. I will have worked and studied hard... and I will have fully deserved it. And I should be entitled to 'tell the world'. God knows, I'll have busted a gut to get it.

But you don't know that, because you really don't know me. Or, put it this way, you only know what I tell you about me.

Cheers

John

PS: If this sounds like a rant at you, it isn't meant to...

 

Although I agree with BM's post I should clarify a little. I may jump to the conclusion that someone cheated ... yes .. but it depends on the information at hand really. Certainly if it's somone you know well then you would be able to make a much more informed opionion rather than just jumping to conclusions (which is human nature I guess).

I was in a situation fairly recently when I went to visit an ex-colleague that greatly suprised me. At one point we were chatting about which certs we had done over the last year or so. He casually dropped in the conversation that he had used braindumps to help him get ready for the exam. I was quite shocked (to say the least) since this guy really really knows his stuff. I didn't spend the rest of the time there condeming him (what would be the point?) but I made sure he knew how I felt about it. I was certainly very dissapointed that he felt he needed to use them, I think he was just being lazy I guess (new child to cope with and also studying for a PHD at the same time). Still, cheating is cheating.

Didn't come across as a rant btw John, no worries.

 

Ouch! I wouldn't like to be put in that position. Sounds like a case of too little time and too much to do... but, as you say, cheating is still cheating. The important thing is he knows that.

Thanks Dom. Much appreciated.

 

I got full marks on one of my A+ exams - 900/900 - and every other exam, while its been a pass they haven't been full marks.
No cheating here, just too many months studying for the same exam always second guessing myself - since then, the score I've been getting has been falling! Not sure if its less time studying or the exams are getting harder

 

Wow! I think you and GBL are the only people I have heard of getting top marks on an A+ exam. That is some going...

I think it is that the exams do get harder. You start with the likes of the A+, and lead onto 271, 272, 270, and so on.

Anyway... 272 next for me... soon. Looking to 'ace' it.

 

I think both of us had a looooooong time to know the material - for me, especially the first one - spent about 9 months studying before I took the exam!


Good luck with the 272 - personally I found it easier than the 271 (despite getting fewer marks!! )

 

Cheers mate... and good luck with the ITIL v3.

 

its possible with lower end certs like the A+ but I would be suprised if it was with MCSE or CCNA exams without cheating.

 

It would be less expected, I agree; however, let's not forget that the MCSE isn't one exam. And, if you've got the working environment and the experience to let you really get to grips with something like AD (as an example), plus you study your backside off at home, then you'll give yourself the best chance possible.

 

I spent over 9 months on the 290 and got 954. Also worked directly with the technology for about 6 months. I'd say that was pretty close to perfect. I believe it's very possible to get 1000 considering how brilliant some of the people I work with are compared to me.



I actually did pretty badly on the A+ exams (601 and 602, those being exam numbers not scores lol). I still passed but it was a wake up call and I adjusted my study technique afterwards.

Since then I've done quite well on my microsoft certs. 936 on the 270 and my most recent 957 on the 290.

Maybe the 291 will ruin my streak

I do not condone cheating in any capacity. I also do not consider a high pass score an indication that cheating has occured. Although it may be a red flag depending on your knowledge of the ability of the individual in question

 

A bunch of guys on one of the other boards all got 1000 on an MS beta test. And some of them had never really used the product they were being tested on! Which is what leads me to believe that's the max score and that MS probably grades on a curve. I'm pretty sure CompTIA grades on a curve too.

 

Are you saying that these guys used dumps to get 1000? They exist even for a beta test?

Unless they're God-like IT gurus!

 

No, I'm saying they all got perfect scores despite getting most of the answers wrong. MS is just using them to create the initial curve everyone else gets graded on. I also think that's why it sometimes seems like the tests get harder over time. They readjust the curve periodically. Take it right after all the idiot beta testers and it seems easy. Take it after a thousand guys get most of the questions right and it seems hard.

 

I'm sure it occasionally works the other way around too though. Maybe the reason Jaytee2305 and I thought 70-297 was easier than the guy who bombed it a year ago is because the last 100 people who took it failed and they readjusted the curve.

Anyways, not sure about Cisco, but with MS and CompTIA a high score just means you're better than your peers, not that you got all the answers right.

 

Few? Nay, sir. If I had to guess, I'd guess "most". Some do it accidentally, but it happens. Unfortunately, braindumping is *far* too prevalent for there to be LESS than 50% of the certified folks who do it. We few who are on this site are vocally against it, sure... but have you ever been to a braindump forum? Far, far, FAR more traffic than this site, and this forum is one of the best.

Well, is he? Is she? Is that a likely or an unlikely possibility??? That's my point... you take in the information, and you process it.

Sure, some people are going to be jealous that someone got a promotion and someone else didn't. Some people are going to be jealous that someone got 1000 and someone else didn't. Know what? I couldn't care less what people think of my scores. I can state the truth, but I cannot change someone's perceptions. People are going to believe what they want to believe. All that matters is that **I** know that I passed legitimately. And I've got a great IT career to show for it.

I know how that is - I've got a photographic memory. Trust me, if I had used braindumps to pass, they'd all be 1000.

That's YOUR choice, mate. You can't make me more positive... or more negative. I will believe what I believe based on the information I receive. And although it sounds all nice and cheery to say that everyone should be given the benefit of the doubt, in the court of public opinion, everyone is NOT innocent until proven guilty. We will all come to our conclusions in our own way... some by logic and analysis, and some by instinct and emotion... and there's nothing anyone can realistically do to *make* other people be more (or less) positive.

Doesn't matter. Praise is nice... but I'd sooner pass legitimately, and be damned what people think. See above.

Notice... I don't post on here when I pass an exam. It really isn't that big a deal for me. What is important is this: I have a good career, and I know my stuff.

 

This then goes back to my reasons for not going for my certs 10 or 15 years ago... MCSEs were ten a penny, and most I met had never even built a server, let alone put it onto a network. Most were what we used to call paper MCSEs. I have to be honest, I didn't believe it was as bad now as you're implying.

I'd love to get into a role that allows me to really use my skills plus my experience (and my certs), but that may never happen (if it does though, then that is great). Thus, I enjoy the challenge of learning (and sometimes revisiting) tech stuff, and putting what I (think I) have learnt to the test by then taking the exams. If I cheat, then the only person I cheat is myself.

I can see your point.

I know there isn't Michael. However, it is a shame that we as individuals do look to the negatives often...

But it must have been at one point in your career... or have exams never played that big a part?